Sunday, November 7, 2010

Apostasy n Etc.

Before I begin I would like to apologise on behalf of the misunderstanders of Islam for their un-Islamic behaviours and ways. I am fully in control of them and they should really have followed the way of the Prophet and understand the context behind each hadith and verses. Here are some of my responds to you Foolster41.

Muslims treating non Muslims – Protest against Hindu temple in Malaysia.
They were mobs, and they shouldn't have played with their food. As Muslims that consume holy animal such as a cow, their acts of stupidity does not represent the majority, as not all Catholic priests are child molesters, don't you agree? And they have been dealt with the law.  At least they didn't act like the Hindus regarding the Babri mosque. What do you want us to do? Mowed them down with machine guns like what the US did to some loons that burnt the Koran? Anyway, your usage of the few, not even long and well-organised political bodies or government or well-established organisation as a presenter of the entire entity is a fallacy.  

Death for apostate-
 Please name at least one that died in Malaysia because of this law. Can you give their names? If you search in the Wikipedia, the numbers (small numbers, but still regretful and unnecessary, for taufik and hidayah is not man’s business, as a story in has proved how even the apostate can return to the righteous way) that were killed for misinterpretations or for reasons still not clear to us, showed the 'seriousness' of the situation. Compare the figures that were killed for apostasy with the figures that died in the Catholic inquisition, be it Spanish or whatever.

“A bedouin gave the Pledge of allegiance to Allah's Apostle for Islam. Then the bedouin got fever at Medina, came to Allah's Apostle and said, "O Allah's Apostle! Cancel my Pledge," But Allah's Apostle refused. Then he came to him (again) and said, "O Allah's Apostle! Cancel my Pledge." But the Prophet refused. Then he came to him (again) and said, "O Allah's Apostle! Cancel my Pledge." But the Prophet refused. The bedouin finally went out (of Medina) whereupon Allah's Apostle said, "Medina is like a pair of bellows (furnace): It expels its impurities and brightens and clears its good. [Sahih al-Bukhari, Vol. 9, #318]

Notably, as Dr. M. E. Subhani explained in his book:
“This was an open case of apostasy. But the Prophet neither punished the Bedouin nor asked anyone to do it. He allowed him to leave Madina. Nobody harmed him.” [Apostasy in Islam (New Delhi, India: Global Media Publications, 2005), pp. 23-24.]”

“Data gathered by UiTM scholar Dr Azam Adil gives some indication. He found that from1994 to 2003, Syariah Courts in Negri Sembilan granted renunciation certificates to 16 applicants, most of whom were former converts to Islam”.

CAIRO: Egypt's official religious adviser has ruled that Muslims are free to change their faith as it is a matter between an individual and God, in a move which could have far-reaching implications for the country's Christians. "The essential question before us is can a person who is Muslim choose a religion other than Islam? The answer is yes, they can," Grand Mufti Ali Gomaa said in a posting on a Washington Post-Newsweek forum picked up by the Egyptian press on Tuesday.

"The act of abandoning one's religion is a sin punishable by God on the Day of Judgment. If the case in question is one of merely rejecting one's faith, then there is no worldly punishment," he wrote.

One link I managed to find,

There is no historical record which indicates that Muhammad (pbuh) or any of his companions ever sentenced anyone to death for apostasy.

Something academic,

Something European,

Caning in Islam is not the same as common law caning. But I’ll elaborate further afterwards.

Time's up. Need to go back to the real world. To be continued. Wallahu a’lam bish-shawabi./Allah knows best.


  1. The Koran clearly teachers death for apostasy, so why would Mohammad preach it if he never caried it out? Wouldn't that mean Mohammad was a liar? I notice you didn't refute the fact that he did command the death for apostasy. (because he did)

    Mohammad said: "So, wherever you find them, kill them, for whoever kills them shall have reward on the Day of Resurrection." amongst other verses. Also there is no indication of limited time or place, and so there is no reason to beleive this is limited any more than it being for all time. Jesus never commanded death for apostasy, and he came before mohammad, whom momammad was supposedly superior to.

    Also, you notice at the very best unbeleivers were ejected from the land, or made to pay the tax and be dhimmis. Mohammad never allowed equality of religion where he lived, and you see the same in Saudia Arabia, Egypt, Iran, UAE, etc. Etc.

    Perhaps people are't being killed in Malaysia (I never said they were), but wouldn't you agree prison sentences for apostasy, or any bias against non-muslims is bad?
    christians may not build churches in Saudia Arabia or Iran, wouldn't you say that's unjust?

    Non-muslim Egyptians have fredom of religion? That is a outright lie.

    You mentioned the burning of Korans. Do you beleive there should be punishment for those who burn Korans in the West/America? Would should that punishment be?

    Out of curiosity, how do you know something is true?

  2. How to know something is true -

    By comparing and contrasting the facts presented by more than a source, weighing how frequent the so said truth-teller lies by accident and looking at his intention (by omitting or not disclosing the related facts and figures.) and what is he trying to suggest. Is it death and destruction or reconciliation and tolerance?

    Unbiased sources -

    The people behind the sources are not of the enemy of the subject they are writing about or part of the entity being attack or the attacking entity. For example, do you know about the so called 'Self Hating Jews’? They are neither Muslims nor Arabs and yet they seem to have more sympathy towards the Palestinians compared to Israel. Don't you think that it's quite strange?

    Death for apostate in the Koran -
    The verses foolster41, please be more specific.

    The decree of killing the spies and the enemies within ordered by Muhammad s.a.w. -

    Please be specific and I can respond more accurately and not just based on hearsay.

    Burning the Koran -
    In a civilised society, everyone is protected from harm and insult.
    Do you agree with this statement?

    If someone failed to show any respect towards others, who's going to protect the society from this arrogant anti social behaviours? Shouldn't there be a law that could protect what is cherished as holy by the members of the society? If there is no law and order, anarchy would be lurking just around the corner.

    Do you know that there are Jews in Iran? Could you provide me with the information that made you suggest the non Muslims are being treated badly in the Muslim nation you’ve mentioned and by whom?

    “Mohammad never allowed equality of religion where he lived” and the proof?

    Sorry for the belated reply. Too many things at hand.

  3. In 1971 west Pakistan committed genocide in East Pakistan murdering between 1.5-3 million Muslims. Their crime was to demand independence. The Western Pakistani troops used the premise of apostasy in which to justify their killing spree.

    In Iraq/Afghasntan/Israel Islamic terrorists refer to their victims (when Islamic) as apostates in which to justify their killing sprees.

    Following your link ref the Spanish Inquistion in over 260 years the total death toll was:
    At least 1080

    I think you should read up a little more before posting evidence which actually counters (and not substantiates) your point.

  4. Oh the above is from me:
    Pounce_Uk its just I don't have a google account.

  5. Give me some time now, pounce_uk, I need to understand the conflict better. Can you provide me with links you have?

    I'll share one with you.

    The numbers killed by the inquisitions were not conclusive. The fact that the only religion that did that, forced conversion and prevention of other faith for a long time and in a very inhumane way is the reason of my exposure.

    Pounce_uk, can you tell me why did you become an ex-Muslim? Thanks for visiting.

  6. I've linked to my sources numerous times. (See my last post.) Pretending my sources don't exist doesn't make them not exist, no matter how uncomfortable they might make you feel.

    Same for sources of koranic verses I cited. If you bothered to click the answering-islam link.

    Once again you expose yourself as someone who doesn't care for the truth.

  7. Quite contrary, I do and you know it. Please foolster41, providing the links without being explicit would be tiresome for me to read them all, please make it specific like quoting or citing and then put up the links. Thanks.

    Unlike ‘higher beings’ that have many red tape regulations and rules (excuses) to shield themselves from the truth (being exposed as liars is more likely), I address everyone directly and without any moderation. Anyone can challenge my version of the truth. This is an open out-post. I don’t have any place to hide. Friends and foes are welcomed. But by just accusing me of this and that without being specific won’t help. How could I dodge invisible bullets? Be specific. Cite the specific verses or sources that you have. Don't link to the entire website, I would not know where to start. Thanks.


Do comment with your open heart n mind.